Waukesha, WI to Newport Beach, CA – Needs Input

Waukesha, WI to Newport Beach, CA and bac; Summer 2009, two people, 21 days.

We plan on taking a week to travel to Newport Beach, staying a week in Newport Beach with a relative, and traveling back for a week. We have most of our destinations planned, yet need help figuring out where would be the best cities and places to stay the night on a budget, what routes may be best to take (as we are traveling in May) and within a conceivable amount of driving and sight-seeing time.

Here are the destinations so far:

To:
Waukesha, WI to St. Paul, MN: ~330 miles, night stay with relatives
Corn Palace, Mitchell, SD
Wall Drug, Wall, SD
Rushmore Alpine Slide, Keystone, SD
Mount Rushmore, Hermosa, SD
Crazy Horse Mountain Memorial, Crazy Horse, SD
Mammoth Site, Hot Springs, SD
Devils Tower, WY
Wyoming Dinosaur Center, Thermopolis, WY
Old Trail Town, Cody, WY (might not be open due to financial issues)
Yellowstone
Bannack State Park, Dillon, MT (depends purely on time constraint, mileage, etc).
Shoshone Indian Ice Caves, Shoshone, ID
Eat at Donnie Mac's Trailer Park, Boise, ID
Salem, OR, night stay with relatives
Travel through Redwood National Park, Crescent City, CA
Travel on Golden Gate Bridge, San Francisco, San Rafael, CA
Finish at Newport Beach, CA

There:
Universal Studios
Disney Land
Sea World, San Diego
Getty Villa, Malibu

Back:
Cabazon Dinosaurs, Cabazon, CA
Bellagio Fountain, Las Vegas (please note one passenger is age 20)
Neon Museum, Las Vegas
Hoover Dam
Grand Canyon South Rim
Holbrook, Wigwam Hotel, night stay
Royal Gorge Route Railroad or Georgetown Loop Railroad, Canon City, CO
Quick stop at the Iowa 80, World’s Largest Truckstop, Walcott


A basic Google Maps view has been setup at http://www.erikendres.com/2009/roadtrip.html


Any help is really greatly appreciated, as this is our first major road trip and we are looking for the best advice to make this trip memorable in a positive way, while trying to use a low budget.

Welcome to the RTA forum!

I have one very big question, how in the world do you plan to fit all 30+ of those stops, plus travel time, into a 21 day trip?

Your diving alone is about 3500 miles west and 2500 east, which works out to 10 full days of driving, before you add any extra stops. Obviously, not all of the stops you've laid out are full days stops, but you've got way more than 11 days worth of activities too.

Perhaps you could give us some sort of basic itinerary on how you were envisioning being able to take all of this in?

Right now I think you've got way more than you could ever fit into 3 weeks, and you're setting yourself up for a trip where you are constantly racing to check off the various attractions from your list, but without having any time to enjoy any of them.

Welcome aboard the RoadTrip America Forums!

Your route and stops look well researched and thought out. As far as time and money budgeting go, I'd suggest that you have at least four weeks to devote to such an endeavor, while costs will depend on your travel style and who all is included in "we". For two people traveling and eating moderately well, $4000-5000 would be a base estimate. Beyond that, there are plenty of articles on planning and ideas of things to do in various states and along major highways on this website, so have3 a look around and let us know if there's some specific information you need. I will tell you that specific restaurants or motels don't often get recommended around here.

AZBuck

I think you've laid out a great "whistle-stop" tour. By that, I mean that you won't have time to explore places in depth but you should have time to take in your surrounds with quick views of the places you want to see.

The trip out west is longer than the trip back home so it will be more of a challenge to make good time and still see the things you want to see going that direction. I see that you're detouring to St. Paul to see relatives. Since that's only just over 300 miles from home, is it possible to leave this leg off and drive a straighter course towards the Corn Palace? It seems to me that you could go see those relatives on another weekend and actually have more time to visit with them than a quick overnight stop. This would shave us some miles and free up some time for ya. Just a thought.

I'm curious about Donnie Mac's Trailer Park. What's up with that? Is it some kind of quirky stop? Infamous eatery?

Your map doesn't look like it goes far enough east in Arizona to take in Holbrook, AZ, and the Wigwam Hotel there. Did you make some changes in your itinerary after doing your mapping?

Midwest Michael, Inevitably, maybe all the destinations are not possible, but it is a goal I would like to plan first before sacrifices need to be made. Then again, it is something I needed to hear to realize it just is not possible in the time constraint.

So, I figure I should just start planning the trip out, take out places that just are not workable in the timeframe, and go from there. Here is what I have timed out for the first four days.

Monday, May 11:
Leave by 1PM, arrive at relatives' by 6:30PM (unable to leave earlier due to commitment)

Tuesday, May 12:
Leave relatives' by 7AM
Arrive at Corn Palace around 12PM (5 hours, 336 miles), leave by 1PM.
Arrive at Wall Drug around 4:30PM (3 hours, ten minutes, 223 miles), leave by 6:30PM.
Arrive at hotel in Rapid City around 7:30PM (~1 hour, ~65 miles).

Wednesday, May 13:
Arrive at Rushmore Alpine Slide at 10AM ($9 per person, may not be open yet), leave by 12PM
Arrive at Mt. Rushmore at 12:10PM (3 miles, 10 minutes, winter hours 7:30am-5pm, $10.00 parking), leave by 2:30PM
Arrive at Crazy Horse at 3PM (15 miles, 30 minutes if US-16/US-385 taken, optional 16A through tunnels will be closed until July, $10 per person), leave by 4:30PM.
Arrive at U.S. Army Corps of Engineers in Hot Springs around 5:15 (~35 miles, ~45 minutes).

Thursday, May 14:
Arrive at Mammoth Site at 9AM ($7.50 per person), leave by 11AM
Arrive at Devils Tower at 1PM (149 miles, 3 hours, $10 vehicle fee), leave by 3PM
Arrive at hotel in Cody at 9PM (322 miles, 5 hours, 30 minutes)

Friday, May 15:
Arrive in Yellowstone

To answer some questions, PNW Judy:
1) We are unable to leave early in the day at the start, so a free night stay at a relatives in St. Paul seems like the best deal, rather than traveling late at night.
2)Donnie Mac's is just an interesting dinner I saw on FoodNetwork that I would just love to stop at. Here is a link to give a photographic expression of the place.
3)Nope! I've adjusted a few things since... I should fix those soon, probably once I figure this plan out.

AZBuck, Thanks for the links. I think I am actually getting stuck on what to do after Yellowstone. All I have for crossing two entire states is one stop and a restaurant.

I can understand wanting to overplan, as long as your willing to adjust your schedule when things sway off course.

While I realise that I asked for an itinerary, I generally find that if you have to break your schedule down into minutes to fit everything in, you're probalby doing too much. At that point, you really can put pressure on yourself to make sure you stick to the timeline, which often isn't as realistic in action as it is on paper. Sometimes you can also get so caught up in seeing the things on a list that you don't stop to see the things that are right in front of you on the road.

Those are just some things to keep in mind.

I am using a timeline purely so I can see that everything fits into a day, from there I have and will continue to adjust to make sure there is adequate time for reststops, gas, food, on the road stops, etc. In the end there will be no need for exact time commitments being set in stone, as that is impossible. Thank you for informing me though of this though and I hope this is understandable, unless you would have a better way of planning?

Thanks for the Donnie Mac's link.

As far as your planning process goes, I do something similar to what you do. However, I do think your timeline is rather tight. I don't think you're leaving yourself enough time to linger if you choose to, or enough time to account for things like finding parking, going through the entrance line to buy tickets/gain entry, etc. for most of the things you're listing.

But it is all a bit of a guessing game and, while you're on the road, a balancing act. In general, I agree with the concerns Michael is raising.

So, things have changed a bit. We decided to reverse our travel plans due to the early may weather in the north still leaving parks and roads closed. I've also loosened up on time schedules, as really I was insane to have it planned like that.

Oh, a question, which park is better in your opinion? Mesa Verde NP or Wupatki National Monument? or are both well worth visiting?


Here is our schedule to Newport Coast, thoughts?

======Day 1======
-Leave by 1PM, Iowa-80 Truckstop by 5PM (209 mi – about 3 hours 35 mins)
-Rest for the night at Underwood Rest Area (267 mi – about 3 hours 57 mins, Free Wi-Fi)
======Day 2======
-Tourist Attraction, Great Platte River Road Archway Monument (200 mi – about 3 hours 8 mins)
-Mountain Time Zone enge of Nebraska entering Wyoming, move clock back an hour
-Rest for the night in Rocky Mountain NP (406 mi – about 6 hours)
======Day 3======
-Rest for the night in Arches National Park (413 mi – about 7 hours 8 mins)
======Day 4======
-Tourist Attraction in Mancos (156 mi – about 3 hours 23 mins)
-Mesa Verde National Park, (19.2 mi – about 38 mins)
-Tourist Attraction, 4 Corners USA (60.1 mi – about 1 hour 25 mins)
-BnB in Bluff, Utah (64.8 mi – about 1 hour 14 mins)
======Day 5======
-Monument Valley (50.9 mi – about 1 hour 2 mins)
-Petrified Forest NP (208 mi – about 4 hours 59 mins)
-Check-in at Wigwam Hotel, Holbrook (28.2 mi – about 27 mins)
-Tourist Attraction, Rainbow Rock Shop and other Route 66 memories
======Day 6======
-Meteor Crater (58.8 mi – about 1 hour 2 mins)
-Wupatki National Monument (71.5 mi – about 1 hour 33 mins)
-Rest for the night in Grand Canyon NP (86.2 mi – about 1 hour 51 mins)
======Day 7======
-Tourist Attraction, Delgadillo's Snow Cap Drive-In (102 mi – about 1 hour 45 mins)
-Hoover Dam (158 mi – about 3 hours 30 mins)
-Pacific Time Zone entering Nevada, move clock back an hour
-Drive up Las Vegas Blvd
-Arrive in Newport Coast (317 mi – about 5 hours 11 mins)

I like that Avatar -- pretty cool.

In the real world -- none of the times listed above are possible. But if you add about 40% extra time for each leg -- you should be pretty close.

Mark

The times listed are purely drive times listed by Google, while planning in my head I generally leave a half hour to an hour of extra time for driving, and then a half hour to an hour of extra time for visiting stops. This trip is mostly just to see the area, it is not to spend lots of time in places. We know we will be back to certain locations in the future for longer periods.

I guess I am honestly confused where time is an issue, as there are only two days of long driving, and they are spread far apart and only one is over 600 miles (of the rta suggested maximum 750 miles per day).

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by erikendres

This trip is mostly just to see the area, it is not to spend lots of time in places.

---

Even with your extra hour or so -- the reality is that you will be unable to stay on that schedule unless you approach this like a job. Traffic considerations in national parks in the summertime will mean that you will not be able to average more than 35 mph in the parks and those google times --for all of their sophistication are more-or-less fantasy. The rule of thumb we use here is over the course of a full day of driving you can average 57 mph on road west of the Mississippi River and 53 mph east of the river.

Quote:

---

I guess I am honestly confused where time is an issue, as there are only two days of long driving, and they are spread far apart and only one is over 600 miles (of the rta suggested maximum 750 miles per day).

---

750 miles is the absolute limit for Speed Run with semi-professional drivers. 500 miles in a day is nearly nine hours in the car. I personally never recommend more than 500 miles in a single day and I personally prefer road trips in the 400 per day range.

Now, if you stuck to that schedule "like it were your job" -- think UPS guy -- you could probably do it -- it wouldn't be much fun. I've had that kind of job -- special events for CART racing -- we would do 1200 miles in a 24 hour period -- but we were professionals and we were not sightseeing.

If you look around this Forum -- there are plenty of posts from members who have completed trips on the scale and complexity of what you are considering -- in a near-similar time-span -- but you'll rarely (see the posts below...) see one of the Moderators recommending this.

Mark

Thank you Mark for your honest and thought out response, it is well appreciated and will be considered largely when the finalization of plans is created.

I certainly still think you are trying to pack your trip full, but I don't think you are totally out of line. As long as you are willing to be flexable and have things you are willing to skip if you realize you are just checking stuff off a list and not enjoying yourself, I think you'll be ok.

The only day I really think is really out of line is your last one. Actually, the first issue you'll have is that you won't gain an hour. Arizona is Mountain Time, but they don't take part in Daylight Saving Time, so in May they will be on the same schedule as Nevada and California. Regardless of that, you're looking at nearly a 600 mile day there, plus time to both see and get across the Hoover Dam (which can see major traffic backups), drive through Las Vegas, and then battle through traffic in the greater LA area. Driving from the Grand Canyon to LA is already a very full day drive, I would strongly recommend against trying to add an additional detour to "see" Vegas on this schedule.

One other red flag I see is your plan to sleep in a rest area on your first night. That just is not a good idea. I'm not sure of the laws in Iowa, but often it is illegal, but more importantly, its not very safe. Rest Areas generally aren't heavily patroled, are poorly lit, and (because of those things) have in some cases been known to attract a criminal element. If you can't spring for a motel (and I will say that a good night sleep is very important between two long driving legs like you've planned), then I would look at another place to stop, like a truck stop, which shouldn't be hard to find in the Omaha/Council Bluffs area.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Midwest Michael

Driving from the Grand Canyon to LA is already a very full day drive, I would strongly recommend against trying to add an additional detour to "see" Vegas on this schedule.

---

Thank you for the input. We originally planned for a night stay in Vegas, yet we decided to take that out to save cash. Yet, we have now taken Vegas and the Hoover Dam out of the schedule. We play on going to Vegas in the future, so no need to rush it now.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Midwest Michael

One other red flag I see is your plan to sleep in a rest area on your first night. That just is not a good idea. I'm not sure of the laws in Iowa, but often it is illegal, but more importantly, its not very safe.

---

Thank you, we found a truck stop to put in its place that seems to have raving reviews.


So following is the current plan to give a driving guideline for travel. Let me know what days just seem impossible to you, what attractions you feel might be worth while, etc. I really thank you for your input on this trip.

===DAY 1=====
-Leave by 1PM, Iowa-80 Truckstop by 5PM
-Rest for the night at Wings America Travel Centre, Avoca, IA
===DAY 2====
-Leave by 8AM
-Tourist Attraction, Great Platte River Road Archway Monument
-Mountain Time Zone enge of Nebraska entering Wyoming, move clock back an hour
-Rest for the night at Johnson's Corner Truckstop
===DAY 3==
-Rocky Mountain NP
-Rest for the night in Arches National Park, Need Reservations, $29
===DAY 4===
-Leave by 8AM
-Tourist Attraction in Mancos
-Mesa Verde National Park
-Tourist Attraction, 4 Corners USA
-BnB in Bluff, Utah
===DAY 5=====
-Monument Valley
-Petrified Forest NP
-Check-in at Wigwam Hotel, Holbrook
-Tourist Attraction, Rainbow Rock Shop and other Route 66 memories
===DAY 6===
-Meteor Crater
-Wupatki National Monument
-Rest for the night in Grand Canyon NP
===DAY 7=====
-Tourist Attraction, Delgadillo's Snow Cap Drive-In
-Pacific Time Zone entering California, move clock back an hour
-Arrive in Newport Coast
CALI FOR 4 DAYS, 5 Nights
===DAY 12=====
-Hearst Castle
-Night stay at Cambria hotel
===DAY 13===
-Fisherman's Warf, Alcatraz
-Night stay at friends'
===DAY 14=====
-Night Stay at Mill Creek Campground, Del Norte Coast
===DAY 15=====
-Night Stay in Salem, Oregon
===DAY 16====
-Dinner at Donnie Mac's Trailer Park Cuisine
-Night Stay in Boise
===DAY 17==
-Shoshone Ice Caves
-Craters of the Moon National Monument
-Night Stay in Yellowstone
===DAY 18===
-Night stay at Hotel in Byron
===DAY 19=====
-Devils Tower
-Mammoth Site
-Night stay options:
U.S. Army Corps of Engineers in Hot Springs
Heritage Villiage in Crazy Horse
===DAY 20===
-Crazy Horse
-Mt. Rushmore
-Rushmore Alpine Slide
-Night stay Rapid City hotel, as too high of crime for a truck stop
===DAY 21=====
-Wall Drug
-Corn Palace
-Night stay in St. Paul
===DAY 22=====
-Back home

I think you're still about at the same level. There's no one day where you are totally out of line, but trying to do so much every day might be more likely to destract from your enjoyment of the trip. I certainly wouldn't look to add anything to this trip.

I would say that if you are planning to camp, I'd look at staying in Custer State Park in the Black Hills.

I'd also say on the way back, going from Rapid to St. Paul is a very long day, and the Twin Cities is a couple hours out of your way on an already very long trip. I'd stick to finding a place closer to I-90, perhaps Albert Lea or Austin, MN.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Midwest Michael

I would say that if you are planning to camp, I'd look at staying in Custer State Park in the Black Hills.

---

I hadn't considered this park before, I'll look into it. Seems like a good alternative.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Midwest Michael

I'd also say on the way back, going from Rapid to St. Paul is a very long day, and the Twin Cities is a couple hours out of your way on an already very long trip. I'd stick to finding a place closer to I-90, perhaps Albert Lea or Austin, MN.

---

The reason for the side track to St. Paul was simply for free lodging with relatives, yet we have been going back and forth on the idea because of the extra drive like you stated.