3 wk western US trip

Printable View

07-15-2006, 02:33 PM
kuodachrome

3 wk western US trip

Hello,

First of all, this is a great site. I'm still in the process of looking through everything.

I was hoping to get some advice, tips, places to see, stop, etc

My plans for my trip are roughly:
Start: Berkeley, CA (July 22)
End: Los Angeles, CA (August 10th)

Places to go:
1. Lassen National Park
2. Crater Lake National Park
3. Olympic NP
4. Maybe stop in Seatle and go to Vancouver
5. Banff/Jasper NP
6. Glacier NP
7. Yellowstone NP
8. Grand Teton NP
9. Maybe Bryce and Zion NP
10. Las Vegas
11. Los Angeles (home)

Do you think that's possible in the amount of time I have? I'll be going with my lady friend. Any advice, comments, etc are greatly appreciated!

Right now, I'm thinking that Olympic, Banff, and Grand Teton are our top priorities. We're still trying to decide how many days to spend at each, what to do, etc. Anyone know of any great hikes, scenic routes?

Thank you everyone!
07-15-2006, 04:02 PM
AZBuck

Best of the Western US (and Canada)

Welcome aboard the RoadTrip America forum.

First off, you're looking at around 3750 miles in 21 days, so that is not a big strain. It averages to less than 200 miles a day. That means you'll actually have some time to enjoy the places you're going to be spending so much time getting to. So as long as you and your companion don't mind driving a moderate amount most days, this could be a very enjoyable, and quite scenic trip. The one thing that's going to be missing is any in depth understanding of any of the great parks you'll be seeing. But as long as you understand that this is a smorgasbord kind of trip - go for it. Just be sure to get a National Parks Pass either before you leave or at the first park entrance that you come to. It will end up saving you quite a bit of money. Also be sure to stop at the visitor centers of each of the parks for advice on which hikes will best meet your desires. These people are a wonderful resource and will have up to the minute information on the conditions of their parks, particularly important during fire season. In any event, you will have a tough time finding non-great hikes or non-scenic routes on this trek. You might also want to have a look at posts by moderator Judy on the Pacific Northwest, such as this one.

AZBuck
07-15-2006, 10:49 PM
W. Larrison

A few random comments?
1. Lassen National Park

If you can take the time and hike up to the top of Mt Lassen. It's doable in a few hours, and the view is incredible on a clear day. Also, depending upon your schedule, you might hit up Burney falls, one of the best falls in California for viewing.

2. Crater Lake National Park

Which way were you thinking of heading out? If you head up 99 towards Bend and beyond, you can come down the Columbia River Gorge to Portland, and from there over to the coast at Astoria. (Don't forget the replica Stonehenge in Golden WA, just across the river...) If you do this, you can drive pretty up along the coast of WA to the Olympic National Park.

For alternatives you can duck up 5 from Portland and see Mt St. Helens, or you could have headed west from Bend through the 3 sisters mountains, which is a nice drive. If you go to Mt St Helens, you may miss part of the WA coast.

3. Olympic NP

Definitely the Hoh Rain Forest, and Lake Crescent, and Hurrican Ridge. There's a nice and not too expensive hotel at Lake Crescent -- if you're with your significant other, its a nice romantic stop. There's also a faily easy hike up to a very lovely waterfall behind the hotel (on the other side of the highway) that's very nice.

4. Maybe stop in Seatle and go to Vancouver

As an alternative, if you're not fixated on Seattle, head for Victoria BC by ferry from Port Angeles, and from Victoria over to Vancouver by ferry. Vancouver is a nice place to visit -- hit up the Royal BC Museum and enjoy the town and ferry rides.

5. Banff/Jasper NP

Depending upon time, there's a slower route to Jasper. You'll take the Icefields Parkway south instead of north. Head north from Vancouver to Whistler, and then NE through Cache Creek, Kamloops and up the 5 to come into Jasper from the west. From Jasper you'll go south towards Banff. Make sure you take the ride on Glacier and visit Lake Louise.

[ ... ]
9. Maybe Bryce and Zion NP

Depending upon your taste, there's again a slower, alternative. Cut SE from south of Provo UT, to Green River. From there you have a western or Eastern route (through Moab) down through Glen Canyon/ Canyonlands National Park to Mexican Hat and the northern entrance to Monument Valley -- possibly including Valley of the Gods, Natural Bridges and a couple of other interesting natural spots. From Monument Valley you can cut SW to come in at the east entrance of Grand Canyon National Park, from whence its about a half day to Vegas. This is more of a backroads route -- whereas the superhighway route from Salt Lake to Las Vegas is easy and fast.
07-16-2006, 01:54 AM
kuodachrome

Thank you! You folks are great! I really appreciate the feedback. I'll add it to my growing word document.

I was trying to decide whether to go for quantity or quality. I love backpacking, so I was thinking of maybe doing a few backpacking trips, but in the end, decided that it might be too tiring. In June, I backpacked a few nights in Yosemite and then spent about a week at Sequoia and Kings Canyon NP. The goal of that trip was more towards quality, so this next trip is more about quantity, I guess.

In your opinion, where would you spend more of your time? Would you cut anything out?

Right now, I'm thinking of skipping Seatle and taking the ferry. I think it'll be a nice ride and should be good to spend a day in a city.

Also, I'm hoping that I won't need to make early reservations for most places that way I can be more flexible. Do you think this is a bad idea? In terms of lodging, I'm thinking of camping most of the time in NP, and possibly at KOAs. Anyone have experience with KOA? Also, what about truckstops for a quick shower? I'm driving a Honda Element, so sleeping in the car is a possiblity. A few nights in a hotel would be nice too though.
07-16-2006, 11:56 AM
AZBuck

Quantity vs. Quality

As Josef Stalin said, "Quantity has a quality all its own." And as you have noted, it is sometimes best to alternate the two. As I pointed out before, I'd treat this trip as a sampler, a way to get a first taste of places, knowing that I'll have to come back later to give all of them the time they deserve. I don't think I'd cut out anything. However, I am a fan of ferry rides - I consider them cheap cruises that give you the best features (time on the water to just relax and think, great views, a chance to talk to fellow travellers) at very low cost. Reservations are hardly ever absolutely necessary, unless you're going to be in an area with a seasonal event happening, and truck stops will be more than happy to rent you a shower and let you sleep in their parking lot as long as you let them know what you're doing and buy something (such as a meal and a shower!)

AZBuck
07-16-2006, 04:40 PM
Mass Tim

Quote:

Originally Posted by kuodachrome

I'm thinking of camping most of the time in NP, and possibly at KOAs. Anyone have experience with KOA?

I have had very good experiences with them - as always, there are exceptions - but, generally, most owners are very proud of their properties and it shows.

The areas you are travelling to seem to draw one in, and latch on to the psyche. I agree with AZBuck, and you should mix it up. There are views to be had from hiking/backpacking that can't be had from the normal overlooks. After all, isn't part of hiking about the reward? These places pay off.

When in Utah, have you considered Kodachrome?
The park is located near Bryce Canyon.
07-16-2006, 09:47 PM
kuodachrome

The last time I was on a ferry was way back when I was in the 5th grade. I still remember it! I just thought it was so cool that the cars went on the boat too. I think I'll for sure that the ferry. Thanks for convincing me.

Yeah, one of the greatest things about backpacking/long hikes is the feeling of accomplishment. I was gushing with that after making it to the top of half dome, so much that I didn't want to go back down. haha!

Thanks for the tips about KOA. Any experience with their internet access? I'm bringing a laptop and hopefully can do some last minute research, reservations, etc with it. I'm hoping to use priceline and bidding for hotels to try to get some cheap rates every now and then.

Kodachrome? I've never heard of it until now, but I might have to check it out. My last name is Kuo (pronouced Koh) and my username is supposed to named after the paul simon song.

Thanks again guys! I'll try to post more questions when they come to me. any thing else?
07-16-2006, 10:26 PM
Midwest Michael

KOA: Not for Me

I'm going to offer a different view of KOA for you. Generally speaking, I avoid them.

Its not to say that KOA's are bad, because on a whole they are pretty decent places. They just aren't the camping experience I'm looking for.

As a tent camper, I like low cost, quiet places with lots of privacy. Running water, flush toliets, and showers are about the only amenities that I am ever interested in, but sometimes just an isolated piece of ground will be the best campsite in the world to me.

KOA's are very good at what they do, which is offer a family-resort type atmosphere. If you are in an RV and/or think top of the line amenities like swimming pools, game rooms, and camp stores are important, than KOAs are a fine choice. They are all independantly owned so the quailty varies from location to location, but for the most part they are pretty good if you want lots of extras and don't mind shelling out a few extra bucks for them.

I stick almost exclusively to State, County, and National parks, with private campgrounds generally being my second choice - and KOAs being pretty far down on my list if I'm going the private route.
07-16-2006, 10:41 PM
Mark Sedenquist

Some more camping ideas

Quote:

Originally Posted by kuodachrome

I'm thinking of camping most of the time in NP, and possibly at KOAs. Anyone have experience with KOA?

I have stayed at scores of them -- like most have said, they offer a McDonald's-hamburger-kind-of-experience. Some are very nice, some are less so. Here is a good overview about camping options in this country. (The article was written for RVers, but the info works for tent campers too).

Mark
07-17-2006, 06:52 AM
PNW Judy

The KOA debate & Ferries

If you plan to take any ferries in Washington, check out the Washington State Ferry website. Be aware that some do fill up quickly for cars and that you will want to be in-line in plenty of time in order to get on. The website will give you particulars.

I love taking the ferry and do it as often as I can. There are numerous ferry options from the Olympic Peninsula to Canada. You can go to Victoria on Vancouver Island and then, from there, onto Vancouver BC on the mainland. Or you can go through the San Juan Islands in Washington state to places near Vancouver BC. The options are almost limitless. Check out the links to figure out what appeals to you most. If you have any questions, let me know.

Now, onto the KOA issue: Whether or not I stay in a KOA totally depends on the type of camping experience I'm seeking. If I'm truly camping, meaning I want a wilderness experience with peace, quiet, and hiking opportunities, I stay in county, state, or national parks. However, if I'm on a roadtrip and just want to stop for the night, I quite often stay in KOA campgrounds. They are perfect for the quick stop. Of course, many other private campgrounds fit that bill as well. It depends on whether or not I can find information on another private campground in the area I'm stopping at. Sometimes they are preferable to KOAs simply because I'm a tightwad and they tend to be cheaper. But I will gladly pay a few bucks more for a pool or a hot tub if the other private campground doesn't have these amenities and stay in the KOA instead.

The main problem with staying at county, state, or national parks when on a roadtrip can be access. Of course, this depends on where you are and where you're going. But if you're burning miles, who wants to drive 10-15-25 miles to just get to the campground? (This is not always the case but it often is. Again, depending on location.) And many of these campgrounds get full very early in the day so, unless you make reservations which I hate to tie myself to when traveling, you will often not be able to get a camping site later in the day. There is nothing more frustrating than driving in circles around a crowded state/national park looking for that elusive open campsite and then, just when you spot it, realizing that someone else is just backing into it. Yes, this has happened to me more than once!

When on the road, I have often gotten to about early or mid-afternoon and figured out where I'll probably end up that night and then gotten out my KOA directory and called the campground to reserve a tentsite for that night (if I think it might be full due to the business of the season or special events going on). This keeps my schedule flexible but keeps me from having to hassle with making prior reservations. It works well.

I would never go to most KOA's for an entire weekend or longer camping experience. (There are a few exceptions like the one near South Bend, WA.) In those situations, I am seeking solitude and wilderness experiences and you just won't get that at most KOA's. However, for a quick over-nighter, they are perfect, imho, except for their price which is always a bit on the high side. So, unless there is a nice private campground in the area that is cheaper, I will stay at a KOA for the night without any complaints.

Hope that makes sense.
07-17-2006, 08:03 AM
Midwest Michael

Rare Problem

Quote:

And many of these campgrounds get full very early in the day so, unless you make reservations which I hate to tie myself to when traveling, you will often not be able to get a camping site later in the day.

I never make camping reservations on a roadtrip, and can only think of a couple of times where I've found "No Soup" at a public campground. In those cases, I've still usually been able to find another park nearby with openings. If I can't, that's when I start looking at private facilities.

I certainly understand the access issue, but honestly, that's one of the reasons I like finding the public sites. Not only does it get your campsite away from the hum of the interstate, but it gives a good excuse to get off the super-slab for a little while. I can almost always find a site within 15 minutes of the interstate, and within 30 minutes of a major city.
07-17-2006, 01:26 PM
kuodachrome

For a trip to Tahoe, we camped in a private campground. We made the reservation without much research. When we got there, we could see the interstate from our campsite AND a safeway or vons was seriously less than 3 minutes walking distance. It was not what I was expecting, but oh well, it was a different style of camping and still fun.

Just curious, how are the roads in Canada? Are they comparable to the States? Any major differences driving in Canada? I'm thinking of taking a ferry to Victoria then to Vancouver. Anything to do while on Victoria or just keep gong on to Vancouver?

ahhh.... thanks again everyone! hopefully i'll have time to do everything!
07-17-2006, 11:12 PM
PNW Judy

Quote:

Originally Posted by Midwest Michael

I never make camping reservations on a roadtrip, and can only think of a couple of times where I've found "No Soup" at a public campground. In those cases, I've still usually been able to find another park nearby with openings. If I can't, that's when I start looking at private facilities.

I certainly understand the access issue, but honestly, that's one of the reasons I like finding the public sites. Not only does it get your campsite away from the hum of the interstate, but it gives a good excuse to get off the super-slab for a little while. I can almost always find a site within 15 minutes of the interstate, and within 30 minutes of a major city.

Maybe it's a regional thing. I have never been able to get a campsite after about Noon anywhere near Mt. Rainier, Mt. St. Helens, in the San Juans, and at the better campgrounds anywhere on the Olympia Peninsula. Even mid-week, if the weather is good, open sites can be non-existent. I've experienced much the same along the Oregon Coast. And we have lots of campgrounds. Maybe we also have more campers?? Or maybe we just have less good camping weather so during the few, short months we have it, EVERYBODY is out doing it?

And it's not unusual for campgrounds around here to be 10-15-25-30 or more miles off the main road. That's a long way to drive after a long, hard day's driving to search for a potentially non-existent campsite, imho.

There are very few campgrounds within 30 minutes of major cities around here...even commercial campgrounds are very scarce and most of the ones that do exist only take RVs, no tent camping allowed. The closest state park to Seattle is only about 20-40 minutes south of Seattle (depending on traffic) but it's also directly in Sea-Tac Airport's flight path. We stayed there once. Never again. Any other state parks are closer to an hour away from the I-5 corridor until you get south of Olympia or north of Everett. And national park campsites are even more remote.

Of course, it's possible that your campsite radar-finding system is more finely honed than mine. However, one a roadtrip when I usually need to do speed runs to burn miles, I just don't have the time. Wish I did, but I don't.
07-17-2006, 11:32 PM
PNW Judy

Some are quiet/private, some aren't

Quote:

Originally Posted by kuodachrome

For a trip to Tahoe, we camped in a private campground. We made the reservation without much research. When we got there, we could see the interstate from our campsite AND a safeway or vons was seriously less than 3 minutes walking distance. It was not what I was expecting, but oh well, it was a different style of camping and still fun.

I've stayed in KOA's and other private campgrounds that are away from roads, stores, etc., and that are quiet, peaceful, and full of trees and other wildlife. And I've stayed in a few that are as you describe. They vary so much that it's always hard to know ahead of time. And I do think they exagerrate a lot in their descriptions. Sometimes the various books and websites that rate campgrounds can be of help with this.

Quote:

Just curious, how are the roads in Canada? Are they comparable to the States?

Yes, pretty much. Their major highways tend to have less lanes than in the US but, besides that, not much different. Well, at least in the parts of Canada near the border. I've been to northern BC and the roads are definitely less crowded and even the major roads are usually 2-land roads. But they are well marked and well maintained.

Quote:

Any major differences driving in Canada?

Not that I've noticed. Just make sure you're looking at your km part of your speedo! Just be careful and courteous. You don't want a ticket out of country!

Quote:

I'm thinking of taking a ferry to Victoria then to Vancouver. Anything to do while on Victoria or just keep gong on to Vancouver?

Lots! If you have time for a drive up to Butchart Gardens, go for it. Sublime! And I'm not really much of a gardens person. And I'm not one of those ladies into going "to tea" but you can't beat tea time at the majestic The Empress in Victoria. Lovely place. The Pig War Museum is kinda fun. Hey, if you don't know anything about the infamous and, actually, very important Pig War, you've gotta check it out. It's been so long since I've been to the Royal Museum, I can't remember what it contains. But I remember being quite impressed. And this was after visiting the museums in London so I figure it must have been good. The replica of Anne Hathaway's Cottage is nice. And they have a very nice Sealand (Seaworld, something like that). You could spend a week on Vancouver Island and not run out of things to do, imho.

To really see some amazing country and rugged beaches, you should try to drive up the west coast of Vancouver Island. You can't go the whole way around but you can see some amazing vistas. The last time we did this was about 15 years ago and it was very rugged but also very secluded with little population. We saw very few cars on the road. We were stopped by a herd of elk just standing on and by the road for about a half-an-hour before they wandered off and we felt it safe to drive. Very cool. It's not unusual to see a lot of interesting sea life on this road either. Unless, of course, it's changed since we were there.

If you visit Vancouver Island, I highly recommend driving up to Nanaimo and taking the ferry to Horseshoe Bay. You'll get 2 benefits from this. First, a drive up the beautiful eastern coast (not quite as remote, rugged, and solitary but still quite wonderful) and, second, Horseshoe Bay is a lovely little town on the acclaimed drive up to Whistler from the city of Vancouver, BC. So it's a lovely drive back to the city. I think it takes about an hour from Horseshoe Bay so it's not a long drive. There is a lovely waterfall near Horseshoe Bay but I don't recall if it's a bit north (and the wrong direction) or on the way back to the city.

Hope this gives you some ideas.
07-18-2006, 09:15 AM
W. Larrison

I'll chime in here a bit too --

Campgrounds -- depends upon the campground. I've been in private campgrounds that were private, wonderful places to stay and very well equipped. And I've been in others including KOA that were like parking lots... My preference is to go for the smaller state or regional or national forest campgrounds, since they seem to be less used -- at least by the big RV folks. I can put up with more tents and people, and less generators and satellite dishes and TV shows.

Reservations are sort of required in my opinion in August -- its the busiest time of the year, so its most likely that you'll have problems getting in. I also tend to travel later in the day, so I'm getting in at around 4-5 pm, which also puts me in the busy time of finding a place to camp. And this goes double for campgrounds in popular areas, like national parks, near urban areas, or along the coast. But.. given a day's notice its not too hard to call ahead and check on campground availability, or have Plan B ready if you're concerned about somewhere to throw out the tent.

For things to do in Victoria and the area -- Judy did a pretty good list. Butchart Gardens is very beautiful, but its about 20-30 minutes north of downtown Victoria. Its moderately expensive and rather touristy and has lots of tour buses in the parking lot. Gorgeous flowers -- although they don't label anything if you want to know what that beautiful plant is.

The Royal BC Musuem is worth a look, just for the history of the area. www.royalbcmuseum.bc.ca is their web site.

There are Orca watching tours that leave from the basin in downtown. There are several pods of Orcas that frequent the straits nearby, feeding on the salmon which run this time of year. Some of the boats are worth the price in themsevles -- basically large (20 person) high powered Zodiac boats where you strap yourself in like into an airplane and skim across the water. (They slow down of course when they get within a couple of miles of the Orcas.)

The sthick in Victoria is a pseudo-British atmosphere. Have some fish and chips, drink a pint in a pub and have fun. The Empress Hotel in Victoria serves high tea -- which is always fun. Only, you have to be dressed appropriately for this -- no Jeans. I found this out one time when i came in with a button down, long sleeve oxford shirt and a new pair of dark blue jeans and hard sole shoes. Didn't get in -- although they let someone in in red, yellow and white golfing outfit.

There's a pretty nice smallish Aquarium, specializing in local sea life including Beluga whales.

If you want to do some hiking, as Judy said, head over to the west coast and there are some wonderful trails through the forests and along the rocky coasts. There's a coastal trail along most of the west coast of Vancouver Island, but its a multi-day backpack trip. Some spots you can visit via road and shortish hikes -- Nice spots. I've driven and camped up to the north end of Vancouver Island, and the farther north you go, the less people, and more trees.

But if you're passing through -- its good for a day, and then mosey up to Sidney or Nanaimo and catch the ferry to the main land. It's a cool place to visit.

You might be a little prepared for ferry lines. They're not uncommon in the summer when the ferry traffic is the busiest. If you're time critical, then you can get reservations on a specific run. However, I've never waited more than one run to get on (a few hours). I always have a book and a couple of soft drinks in the cooler and a folding camp chair or two, and after I've gotten out and walked around a bit, I'll just settle back and relax and wait for "island time" to catch up with me.

Oh yeah.. Judy mentioned the Pig War. That's a little known incident where the US and the British militaries squared off for a while in a border incident in the 1850's. Fortunately cool heads prevailed and after a face off for a while, the borders were resolved to what they are today. That's over in the San Juan islands, near Friday Harbor on San Juan Island (not walking distance from the ferry dock, though). Sometimes you can get a ferry that stops at Friday Harbor before going on to Victoria, but I don't think the ferries from Port Angeles do that.. Friday Harbor is a nice little town and I've been out to the Pig War museum and camps (theres an "American Camp" and a "British Camp"). The San Juans are really nice to boat around and explore -- but somewhat hard to get to in passing.
07-18-2006, 12:52 PM
Midwest Michael

Maybe I've just been lucky

Quote:

Maybe it's a regional thing. I have never been able to get a campsite after about Noon anywhere near Mt. Rainier, Mt. St. Helens, in the San Juans, and at the better campgrounds anywhere on the Olympia Peninsula. Even mid-week, if the weather is good, open sites can be non-existent.

I can say that I've never once been shut out looking for a campsite anywhere. Occationally, I've had to find a second choice site, but I've never been unable to find a campsite without a reservation.

I don't think it is a regional thing though, as I've had luck pretty much everywhere - even up in your next of the woods. In southern Washington state, we found a great county park on a hill right above the beach where we there was only one other camping group in the whole park, on a Friday night in late June. The next night we did find the Prov. Park we were planning to stay at about 30 miles from Vancouver was full, but found a nice private campground along the same road.

Quote:

However, one a roadtrip when I usually need to do speed runs to burn miles, I just don't have the time. Wish I did, but I don't.

That might be a big part of it. I rarely do camping on true speed runs. We will frequently be doing all-day drives, but we usually start looking for places to sleep early enough in the evening where we could find a back-up plan before its too late - and rarely have specific places we need to be.

On true speed runs, I usually drive until 2-3 AM or later, which makes camping rather unpractical.